Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over sea

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4yorks
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Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over sea

Postby 4yorks » 13 Aug 2014, 15:53

I have been to Dover, then a small village called St Margaret's at Cliff near Dover and I was able to pick up French Mobile phone networks and French radio stations. ( I was even able to make a call on the French Network )

Recently I was in Hollyhead, Wales and I could pick up Irish Radio stations in my car and my phone could see Irish mobile phone networks ( O2 Ireland, Vodafone Ireland) as well as the normal UK ones, but I couldn't connect for some reason.

I've noticed that on the Shetland islands to Norway is 180 miles. Would it be possible if you're on a high cliff , to pick up radio station and Mobile networks over that distance. or impossible? how about AM.

Thanks! :D

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby Martinedwards » 14 Aug 2014, 07:41

"a" radio wave?

yup, worked california on 40m last night.

Phone freqs?

maybe.....

maybe not!

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby ChrisCSL » 15 Aug 2014, 13:53

The people on the Kent coast have been moaning about this for a while. They get hit with roaming charges for local calls.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -KENT.html

I know if I used to go over on a Booze Cruise, my phone turned French just as soon as we cleared Dover harbour. I think that across the North Sea to Nogland might be pushing it though.

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby bigpimp347 » 15 Aug 2014, 14:20

regularly work the USA on my CB radio :)
http://livecbradio.co.uk UK's only 24/7 live stream

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby acl777 » 17 Aug 2014, 20:19

Yep, I live in Norwich and regularly pick up Dutch,Belgian, French and German FM radio. As far as AM transmissions go I often pick up stations from the US during the winter months.

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RogerD
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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby RogerD » 18 Aug 2014, 06:51

4yorks wrote:Recently I was in Hollyhead, Wales and I could pick up Irish Radio stations in my car and my phone could see Irish mobile phone networks ( O2 Ireland, Vodafone Ireland) as well as the normal UK ones, but I couldn't connect for some reason.


Getting a strong signal isn't the whole story, for connecting. There's a time limit for how your phone's signals can fit into the time-sliced communications system. If you're too far away, the limitations of the speed of light/radio means that your signal can't sync up properly with the base station before the next cycle of digital pulses. It's something like 35km for GSM IIRC

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby acl777 » 19 Aug 2014, 22:14

Very interesting RogerD. I had no idea this was the case. I'm guessing if mobile phones were analogue it would be as simple as a strong signal.

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby RogerD » 20 Aug 2014, 07:33

That's right.

More details here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timing_advance

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby SecretShortwave » 15 Sep 2014, 10:15

you often get enhanced propagation other sea paths at vhf and uhf for many different reasons ducting is the most common reason
due to temperature inversions which are more common over sea paths, this creates a pipeline which gives a ideal medium for radio waves to travel in
but can be very localised a guy 2 or 3 miles inland may be hearing nothing. With practice you can get pretty good at predicting when this is going
to occure your self, any time you have fog or mist is a good sign temp inversion is taking place so there is a good chance of some ducting also dawn and dusk
due to the different layers warming up and cooling down at different rates.Type tropospheric ducting into google for a much better explanation. You also get enhanced prop at HF over a sea path due to water being a better reflecting medium than land for radio waves

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby acl777 » 13 Oct 2014, 21:07

RogerD wrote:That's right.

More details here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timing_advance

Thanks for the link.

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby acl777 » 13 Oct 2014, 21:09

SecretShortwave wrote:you often get enhanced propagation other sea paths at vhf and uhf for many different reasons ducting is the most common reason
due to temperature inversions which are more common over sea paths, this creates a pipeline which gives a ideal medium for radio waves to travel in
but can be very localised a guy 2 or 3 miles inland may be hearing nothing. With practice you can get pretty good at predicting when this is going
to occure your self, any time you have fog or mist is a good sign temp inversion is taking place so there is a good chance of some ducting also dawn and dusk
due to the different layers warming up and cooling down at different rates.Type tropospheric ducting into google for a much better explanation. You also get enhanced prop at HF over a sea path due to water being a better reflecting medium than land for radio waves

Yes I know what you mean. I think tropospheric propagation is the most compelling of all.

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over sea

Postby 26TM800 » 13 Dec 2015, 14:53

185 miles is nothing for *MW or FM but is asking a lot for phone.. but
keep watching this map and try it :-)
http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo_nwe.html

consider getting a cheap phone hacking off the aerial and soldering on a 915mhz yagi off ebay

similar discussion here may be of use: http://skywavesdx.org/viewtopic.php?f=53&p=7932#p7932

good info about the timing problem, that may explain why despite the fact that my Phone often locks onto Irish networks in Wales I can never text or call with them

*when NRK Kvitsoy 1314 was still on it covered most of the UK in daytime

my nearest and most regular Norwegian FM tx is Bokn 97.3 873km away I hear it a few times every year on tropo here in East Cheshire

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over

Postby 26TM800 » 13 Dec 2015, 15:01

SecretShortwave wrote:. You also get enhanced prop at HF over a sea path due to water being a better reflecting medium than land for radio waves

definitely, I've noticed the MUF is consistently higher at the coast,
if 10 meters is marginal at home it will be open on the North Wales Coast

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kr0ne
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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over sea

Postby kr0ne » 16 Dec 2015, 12:35

26TM800 wrote:consider getting a cheap phone hacking off the aerial and soldering on a 915mhz yagi off ebay


I haven't seen a mobile phone you could hack the aerial off since the 1980s!

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Re: Can you pick up a radio wave 185 miles from source over sea

Postby Admiral » 22 Dec 2015, 06:31

26TM800 wrote:185 miles is nothing for *MW or FM


Schoolboy error, quoting frequencies and modes as the same thing.

185 miles across icy seas, around 1Ghz on 1w, with an internal antenna the size of a hair grip? In the real World, I say no chance.

But you never know.
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